Jump to content


Finally have an engine in pieces


  • Please log in to reply
128 replies to this topic

#16 Mike Goldthorpe

Mike Goldthorpe

    Russian Bike Nut

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 471 posts
  • Joined:21-January 10
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Auckland, NZ

Posted 16 October 2014 - 02:30 PM

Camshaft followers, old and new, sitting in the engine case
20141016 180557
You can see there's a slightly different method of oil lubrication involved - the older style having a hole to direct the flow of oil and the newer letting it splurge out around the edges.

older follower

Newer follower

They are roughly the same size - I don't think the difference will make any, ahem, difference.


side by side
This is the wear on hte older follower.  Not much, dare say it could be machined off, but the newer style should ensure this is not an issue anymore for me.

wear
Finally, a shot inside the crankcase.  Hope it's clear :-)
inside
Hoping to pick up my crank today or tomorrow, along with some allen headed screws to replace the flat head ones.  Oh, and loctite, as this appears to be the fastener fixer du jour.  I've also bought a media blaster attachment for my compressor - thinking of giving soda blasting a go to once and for all remove the household black paint the PO lathered everywhere on the bike.  There's still patches of it on the engine, gearbox and final drive I want to get rid of.  Then it's the slow reassembly.

#17 racepres

racepres

    Russian Bike Nut

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,342 posts
  • Joined:08-November 11
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Middle of the Mitten

Posted 16 October 2014 - 03:10 PM

FWIW machining the pits off from the old follower, would probably result in the hardening being removed, and rapid wear would result.
Those type parts are rarely hardened thru and thru..more likely surface hardened.
Replacement is Wise.

#18 Mike Goldthorpe

Mike Goldthorpe

    Russian Bike Nut

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 471 posts
  • Joined:21-January 10
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Auckland, NZ

Posted 18 October 2014 - 01:17 AM

Hi RP!  Dare say it would and getting them done properly (machined flat and then hardened) would cost me the same as the set I bought.  
Pissing with rain today and same forecast for tomorrow.  Bugger really as yesterday was fine and Monday is meant to be good too, weather wise.  Typical!  Was going to try out my new toy and soda blast the crankcase before reassembly.  Got the crank back from the reconditioner - he reckoned it was OK to use so I will.  Took the opportunity to get Allen headed screws for all the ones I took out and then thought I'd remove hard edges from the piston tops.  Pictures to follow, as ever, of before and afters....but here's the pistons sitting on my bench tonight.
Attached File  image.jpg   216.6K   14 downloads

Edit - I have no idea why the image is upside down.  It's the right way on the iPad....but here at work, I see it upside down.  Blimmin' modern technology....

#19 Mike Goldthorpe

Mike Goldthorpe

    Russian Bike Nut

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 471 posts
  • Joined:21-January 10
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Auckland, NZ

Posted 19 October 2014 - 09:21 PM

More on the pistons
This is what the piston from the factory looks like.  Sharp edges and a boss with an arrow to indicate direction.

20141018 170431
Luckily, there's also a paint indicator to let me know which way the pistons should point
20141018 170503
So I didn't feel too worries about filing and sanding to get everything smooth and rounded, as so


20141018 170422
Now, some people will tell me that the crown should be a bit rough for carbon to stick on it - acts as an insulation layer, apparently.  And some people will tell me to polish it so carbon doesn't stick.  I like shiny things so I went for option #2 - though that's only 1200 grit emery cloth - no polish involved.
I also got a new toy.  I got a compressor from Xmas last year.  All I have been doing with it is inflate bicycle tires and blow air into small holes....so when I saw this for NZ$49.99, I thought "Why not?"
20141018 170549
Gave it a preliminary go yesterday - only had a 1/2 kilo of baking soda but boy, what a difference it can make!  A mess too....but all that old paint on the engine cases came right off!  Of course, now the gearbox will need blasting too as it is really apparent that blasting has been done!  I also think I need to get backing soda in bulk - it's used for other things in the house too, not just cooking.

#20 luca.stere

luca.stere

    Russian Bike Nut

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 619 posts
  • Joined:27-February 14
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Romania

Posted 20 October 2014 - 12:29 PM

These pistons are a newer version with a higher compression ratio. You will have more power and less fuel consumption.

#21 Mike Goldthorpe

Mike Goldthorpe

    Russian Bike Nut

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 471 posts
  • Joined:21-January 10
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Auckland, NZ

Posted 20 October 2014 - 01:46 PM

More power?  :-) the cafe crowd better watch out!
Pistons I bought along with heads from CMSI over a decade ago.  Think CMSI wound up and flogged their stock off quite cheap.  Over a decade ago....man, just goes to show what happens if you let life get in the way!  I was single then, training for a marathon, had Ural bits all over my bedroom in the flat I shared.....then a woman appeared!  
Not complaining though.  She allowed me to restart my hobby where I left off....
Heads will go to some engine people that did a friend's BMW R51/3.  Not cheap but he says it transformed his bike.  And with more power, it's lucky I bought the 2ls brake from CMSI too - more speed needs more stop!

#22 luca.stere

luca.stere

    Russian Bike Nut

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 619 posts
  • Joined:27-February 14
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Romania

Posted 20 October 2014 - 01:54 PM

Women, an obstacle to progress...

#23 Mike Goldthorpe

Mike Goldthorpe

    Russian Bike Nut

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 471 posts
  • Joined:21-January 10
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Auckland, NZ

Posted 21 October 2014 - 09:55 PM

Well, soda blasting is messy!  But sure is worth it!  After cleaning for ages to make sure all the bicarbonate of soda is out, it's into the oven and popping in the front crank bearing and timing gear.  Then in go the followers and.....wtf??  The right hand side inlet follower fouls against the oil pump gear on the cam.  That explains why that gear is so thin on later camshafts!
I am annoyed!  What to do.....order a later camshaft, transfer the new bearing and old timing gear over or get the old followers machined flat and hardened?  Is there other advantages to getting a new camshaft?
Clean engine now sitting in garage while I have a relaxing beer and ponder the next move.  I am miffed.
Once I've calmed down, I'll do the crankshaft.  I reused the old slingers - soda blasted them too...after heating a la Ken then sonicating them in ethyl acetate at work.


Really annoyed about that camshaft!

Oh, and pics to follow - don't know why but they keep coming up upside down.  Stupid iPad.....

#24 Mike Goldthorpe

Mike Goldthorpe

    Russian Bike Nut

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 471 posts
  • Joined:21-January 10
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Auckland, NZ

Posted 22 October 2014 - 02:52 AM

Oh poo....
Attached File  image.jpg   151.33K   18 downloads

#25 Mike Goldthorpe

Mike Goldthorpe

    Russian Bike Nut

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 471 posts
  • Joined:21-January 10
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Auckland, NZ

Posted 22 October 2014 - 04:24 PM

Soda blasted cases
image
image

image
I love the attention to detail and the quality of the castings.....
20141022 133954

However, shiny cases don't solve this problem

20141022 144916
This shiny white bit in the picture above is the gap 'twixt follower and the bushing where the end of the cashaft goes.  That gap is smaller than the gear in the picture below.
20141022 145005

Wish I had known this before!  And, of course, with that nut breaking off while gently presing in the rear bearing carrier (I was tightening each nut slowly, like doing a cylinder head on a car).  I hope the easy outs I have will work getting that little bit out.  I may replace the lock wire with spring washers and loctite - I suspect getting lock wire bolts will be a bit of a nightmare and no way can I drill them.

Two steps forward, one step back.....

#26 Russ Noe

Russ Noe

    Russian Bike Nut

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 549 posts
  • Joined:30-August 12
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Northern Oregon, USA
  • Interests:Steam machines, Urals, all Motorcycles, Aviation, Good People, Red Wines, Life, and the ability to enjoy them all.

Posted 22 October 2014 - 05:51 PM

View PostMike Goldthorpe, on 21 October 2014 - 09:55 PM, said:

[snip]

Oh, and pics to follow - don't know why but they keep coming up upside down.  Stupid iPad.....
Well, you ARE in the Southern Hemisphere while we are "up" here...
~RN

#27 Mike Goldthorpe

Mike Goldthorpe

    Russian Bike Nut

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 471 posts
  • Joined:21-January 10
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Auckland, NZ

Posted 22 October 2014 - 06:49 PM

View PostRuss Noe, on 22 October 2014 - 05:51 PM, said:

Well, you ARE in the Southern Hemisphere while we are "up" here...
~RN

:-D

Oh wait....so do I have the orientation of my new oil pump wrong?  I mean, Coriolis effect and all that.....  :-O

Been having a Google through everything that turns up if I search "Ural rear main bearing carrier" and I see the newer models do not have lockwire.  I shall therefore dispense with mine too - get some new bolts, spring washers and loctite and button up the rear that way.  At least that way I get to use new bolts, not 1975 vintage ones.  But before that, I have to find my easyout set and then pray to all the gods that they will work (never have done yet!).

Starting to wonder if this bike will be ready for next years Distinguished Gentlemans Ride!!

#28 Russ Noe

Russ Noe

    Russian Bike Nut

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 549 posts
  • Joined:30-August 12
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Northern Oregon, USA
  • Interests:Steam machines, Urals, all Motorcycles, Aviation, Good People, Red Wines, Life, and the ability to enjoy them all.

Posted 22 October 2014 - 11:53 PM

View PostMike Goldthorpe, on 22 October 2014 - 06:49 PM, said:


[snip]
But before that, I have to find my easyout set and then pray to all the gods that they will work (never have done yet!).

Starting to wonder if this bike will be ready for next years Distinguished Gentlemans Ride!!
Mike:
Drill the hole for the Easyout using a left hand drill.  Sometimes the broken bolt simply screws its way out while drilling.

#29 Mike Goldthorpe

Mike Goldthorpe

    Russian Bike Nut

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 471 posts
  • Joined:21-January 10
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Auckland, NZ

Posted 23 October 2014 - 12:35 AM

Excellent advice Russ!  Wish I had thought if that!  As it was, I used a tiny bit in the Dremel, drilled a couple of shallow pits, banged a thin screwdriver with a hammer to make a slot and just unscrewed the remnant out.  Your way would have worked heaps better!
Right, next stop, the Bolt Shop for some decent small bolts and to repay my 60 cents I owe them.  Then at least I'll have the bottom end done and I can get the oil pump in while I wait for a new camshaft.  Still miffed about finding out the follower fouls the oil pump gear!  Still, must be grateful for small mercies....that bit of bolt came out nice and easy!

#30 Russ Noe

Russ Noe

    Russian Bike Nut

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 549 posts
  • Joined:30-August 12
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Northern Oregon, USA
  • Interests:Steam machines, Urals, all Motorcycles, Aviation, Good People, Red Wines, Life, and the ability to enjoy them all.

Posted 23 October 2014 - 12:44 PM

View PostMike Goldthorpe, on 23 October 2014 - 12:35 AM, said:

[snip]  Still, must be grateful for small mercies....that bit of bolt came out nice and easy!
Mike:
Glad to hear you got the broken bolt out.
Another job well done.
~RN




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users