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Finally have an engine in pieces


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#1 Mike Goldthorpe

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 02:47 AM

Pictures to follow but for now, rest assured I have an engine in bits.  Used the BMW Ed Korn many in one tool to remove the rear bearing carrier and the bearing.  Whole object was to replace Soviet bearings and check the slingers - number 8 wire poking resulted in a fair amount of crud coming out.
Things to do now is check the crank and remove the slingers.  It seems replacement slingers don't come with holes to screw them back on....annoyingly.
Another thing that I find interesting is the front bearing carrier.  The hole that feeds the tube that lubes the bottom gear is tiny on an M66 but looking at pictures of flathead engines, the same hole is large.  Any reason for that?
I admit pictures speak louder than typing - I'll get them up tomorrow.

#2 Mike Goldthorpe

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 06:31 PM

Finally worked it out :-)
First of - the front bearing carrier.  Look at that small hole.
Front bearing carrier - note small hole to feed the timing gear oiling tube
Now compare it to the sidevalve version http://advrider.com/...10&postcount=49 - MotoJ has the same if you look in his rebuild thread.  Why the difference?
Back of the small hole....note there is a hint that this small hole used to be a bit larger
I hope this picture shows the other side with the 'shadow' of what I assume is the old hole.

The reason the egine was stripped was to check the slingers and change the bearings.  #8 wire was used to scrape along inside the slingers to see what I could find...


Slinger contents
I might just take them off and bring them to work - a spell in the sonicator with acetone might shift the residue after I get at them with the wire scraper and leave me with clean slingers to put back on.  I think the crank is fine - I'll get it professionally checked out (by the bloke rebuilding my Citroen engine...).

#3 luca.stere

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Posted 24 September 2014 - 12:32 AM

View PostMike Goldthorpe, on 23 September 2014 - 06:31 PM, said:

  #8 wire was used to scrape along inside the slingers to see what I could find...


The slingers must be cleaned very well, it is very important. Even when you think you cleaned enough you will have to check carefully the slingers. If some dirt remains after the cleaning that piece of dirt will detach from the slingers and it could cover the lubrication holes from the bolt cranck. Your slingers are ok, watch what I have found on a very dirty engine:

https://www.youtube....h?v=PuZtn98_0YE

That hole from the front bearing carrier is ok, a small hole will maintain a good presure for the lubrication crank. Maybe the hole from MotoJ front carrier was modified, who knows...

#4 Mike Goldthorpe

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Posted 24 September 2014 - 01:05 AM

Hi Luca - that's a slingerfull of gunk there!  Luckily I happened to be checking through the seller's websites and saw http://moto-boxer.co...roducts_id=2386 so I might just get them.  I need a new flywheel bolt as I want to sacrifice one to clear up the crankshaft threads (the engine reconditioner doing my Citroen engine cuts grooves in the bolt, hardens it and uses it as a tap).
I'm not changing the hole sizes of the carrier - I assume the IMZ engineers had a reason :-). Just seemed interesting....and you can see the shadow of the original big hole.  
Now I'm at this stage I am following your progress very closely!  You've pretty much captured everything I need - glad about your exhaust as I can get the same sent to my sister in law for her son to pick up and bring ;-). I would do it myself but my suitcases are always full of clothing, duvets, duvet covers, etc, etc, etc.  wife never leaves any room for my wants! ;-)

#5 Mike Goldthorpe

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Posted 24 September 2014 - 07:11 PM

Crap from slinger
Scrapings from a slinger.  This is hideously claggy and sticky - should have worn gloves.  While not as bad as Luca's example above, it does suggest slingers should be checked if you buy a neglected bike.  Amazing the amount of stuff, especially considering there is an oil filter too. I guess cheap bikes attract cheap owners......

#6 Mike Goldthorpe

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Posted 04 October 2014 - 01:06 AM

Barrels done, degreased and painted.  I read somewhere that one can pop them into the oven while wife was out.  Obviously written by a single man with no experience of women.....  I used my bbq - charcoal, of course :-)
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The pushrod tubes were right buggers to get out - appear to have been shellacked in.  I hope they can be reused after a touch of fixing....
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Front bearing and rear bearing pop in nicely when bearing is frozen and carrier is heated.  Here's the rear.
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Top tip - use oven mitts and don't drop the bearing in at an angle.  Oven hot metal burns and skew wiff bearings stick.....
Car needs a service and next to the garage I use is a soda blaster.  I foresee 2 birds being killed with just the one stone :-). I rather fancy a clean crankcase!

#7 Peter Williams

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Posted 04 October 2014 - 04:13 AM

What a lot of people don't realise is that the oil filter in M-66 and later bikes only lengthens the time before slinger clean-out, it doesn't stop the need. The slingers act as centrifugal cleaners and take out particles that are too small for the filter to stop.

#8 Mike Goldthorpe

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Posted 04 October 2014 - 04:52 AM

I can confirm the fines nature of the malodorous crap I scraped out!  On rubbing it twixt finger and thumb it resembled anti seize compound.....except for one piece of wire.  I hate to think where that came from - I've been looking but can't see where it peeled off from.
I think anyone who has a barn find Ural from the 70s or 80s is well advised to take the crank out, replace the slingers (no point cleaning them when there's new ones out there) and bearings and ride safe in the knowledge that there's one less thing to worry about!

#9 Mike Goldthorpe

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Posted 07 October 2014 - 01:40 AM

Argh!  Bought slingers to replace the old ones - holes aren't in the same place.  Not out by much....but out, nonetheless.  Can anyone tell me if the various cranks were drilled differently for slingers?  I assumed the M66 was close enough to the sidevalve engines for some commonality and ordered accordingly.  
Anyway, I can either re drill the holes or buy slingers without and drill them myself.  Blimmin aftermarket parts!  Still, engine reconditioner I mentioned before showed me a flathead V8 whose owner had bought expensive aftermarket heads for.....which didn't quite fit.  Valves hit the head as the combustion chambers weren't matched.  THAT was an expensive mistake!

#10 haj

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Posted 07 October 2014 - 08:29 AM

why replace if you can just scrape them out ?
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#11 luca.stere

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Posted 07 October 2014 - 12:27 PM

View PostMike Goldthorpe, on 07 October 2014 - 01:40 AM, said:

Can anyone tell me if the various cranks were drilled differently for slingers?  I assumed the M66 was close enough to the sidevalve engines for some commonality and ordered accordingly.  

Is a little difference at the holes but it can be mounted.

#12 Mike Goldthorpe

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Posted 07 October 2014 - 01:59 PM

View Posthaj, on 07 October 2014 - 08:29 AM, said:

why replace if you can just scrape them out ?
To be sure there's nothing left.  I see it as the slingers not being that expensive so can be treated as a consumable - like bearings.  Once the engine is all together, I don't want that nagging feeling I left a bit of crud in that then detaches and ends up in the crank rollers....
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Here's the two rollers side by side.  New one is the shiny one ;-)
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Measuring from outer edge, new slinger
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And outer edge, old slinger.  Apologies for orientation....iPad playing up....
I'll go with Luca's advice and make it fit.

#13 haj

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Posted 08 October 2014 - 04:08 AM

I don't see it as a problem if a little bit of crud is left in there..

Make sure you measure the hole that goes around the flywheel (if I remember correct) too, if that one is too small you'll have problems..
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#14 Ken Ulrich

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Posted 08 October 2014 - 11:43 PM

Ta-Dah, Ken To the rescue again....LOL,  when I am at the point of doing the slingers, and after the experience of trying to gouge them out etc.  I pulled out the propane torch, and put the heat to them, and you will be amazed how they light up and burn. That goo in there is almost pure carbon, and with the fuel and oil vapor embedded in the carbon it like July 4th. So do it out side. I heat till I get a very dull red, and then drop in a bucket of water. THey will be clean.So many parts for the Ru and UK cycles are made by different companies and factories, and  screw spacing is just off enough to give one a fit, by using the originals, you avoid that problem. When reinstalling, use about the same method as I pointed out for the clutch bolts, loc-tite them well ,as a loose scupper will deprive oil to the bearings fast. New bolts if you can acess them.....Ken    :smileywaving:

#15 Mike Goldthorpe

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Posted 13 October 2014 - 01:56 AM

Reuse, eh?  Ok then.
Attached File  image.jpg   190.93K   13 downloads As you can see, there's a bit of a gouge take out of one.  Trimmed it with a Dremel - hope it works.
Next on my list is oil pumps.  I bought one from MHMetalheart.  Reasons being that many years ago I bought a uprating kit.....which means the bolts holding the original pump are marginally on - kit didn't come with longer bolts!  "Change the gears back" I hear you say......if I could find said gears, I would!  Perils of moving houses and time.
Here's the pumps side by side
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Here you can see the plate used to be able to utilise the updated gears
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The bolt issue is apparent here, eh.
One thing I was wondering.....can I use a rolled pin to attach the shaft to the pump?  As you can see, it is stamped which I can do.....but might be easier to drill through then pin the shaft on.  Any reason why one should not?
Attached File  image.jpg   153.34K   8 downloads a picture to show the shaft stamped on the pump.
Look forward to your collective wisdom!




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